Celebrating 10 years! 2007-2017

Time to study for UBE

My state is now a UBE state, so I thought I'd maybe sign up wolfman04/26/17
That is plenty of time to prepare if you actually spend the thirdtierlaw04/26/17
Thanks. Yeah, motivation will be key. And Adaptibar feels li wolfman04/27/17
2 months? It's enough time only if you put in at least a 2- anonattempt04/27/17
Why go through the stress, expense, and time commitment just mrtor04/26/17
Thanks, Mrtor. As far as "Why go through the stress, expe wolfman04/27/17
you already failed the bar in the past, haven't been in law dingbat04/26/17
*this guarantee is no more valid than Cooley's guarantee tha dingbat04/26/17
That's funny. It'd be kinda funny if I passed though, but I wolfman04/27/17
I studied for the bar exam while working a full time non leg bucwild04/26/17
Thanks, man. Yeah, I'd appreciate that. Carlwolfmann@gmail.c wolfman04/27/17
I think you should be able to pass, granted I did not work w c384412204/26/17
Thanks for the advice. My throwaway is carlwolfmann@gmail.co wolfman04/27/17
I passed the MBE for FL using Adaptibar....I highly recommen kretan18204/27/17
yeah thanks I'm focusing on the MBE for the time being wolfman04/27/17
I worked full time up until three weeks before the exam. Sig mnjd04/27/17
thanks wolfman04/27/17
If I may ask, why not just get your debt in order. As long a lawyer204/27/17
I am not opposed to paying SOMETHING (after all, I am repayi wolfman04/27/17
I understand. I would strongly suggest consulting an ethics lawyer204/27/17
Actually, I have a question about that, for the future: how wolfman04/27/17
I got a recommendation from a classmate who had similar issu lawyer204/27/17
thanks wolfman04/27/17
UPDATE: thanks for the advice y'all. I signed up for the UBE wolfman05/05/17
UBE is a lot easier than California. I took the UBE while wo jdtrash05/11/17

wolfman (Apr 26, 2017 - 11:59 am)

My state is now a UBE state, so I thought I'd maybe sign up for the July bar and see what happens. I work full-time as a paralegal, but have decent hours, pretty much a 9-5. I won't be able to start studying until May 15 or so, but should hopefully be able to put in steady hours after that...

I'm pretty familiar with the MBE (took the old exam after LS, didn't pass, and didn't bother after while working in a non-law job), generally do well on multiple-choice exams, and like the idea of an exam with at least 50% based on the MBE and the practice tests (I'm a pretty good writer under time pressure, my MPTs were good when I took the bar although my essays were horrendous).

Do people think mid-May to late July is enough time to study for the UBE while working?

I probably won't be admitted even if I pass the exam and jump through all the other hoops my state requires (I have defaulted private loans which I can't - and won't - pay off), but I feel like it'd be nice to at least know I passed the damn exam... I know UBE has a numerical score, so by pass I mean "get a 266 or higher"... 270 would be nice.

Also, is AdaptiBar worth it? I won't pay for a prep course, but a computer-based multiple-choice thingy seems appealing... I already have the Kaplan book with like 1000 MBE questions.

Don't bother telling me that I'm a loser who'll never practice law - I'm OK with the latter part of that, if that is how things shake out, but I'd still like to see if I can get a 266 on the UBE.

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thirdtierlaw (Apr 26, 2017 - 12:46 pm)

That is plenty of time to prepare if you actually spend the time to do it. That was the downfall of many people who were working while studying for the exam. This is especially true because you do not have any apparent desire to be admitted to the bar at this time. It'll be easy to make excuses for why you can skip a day of studying and the stakes of failure aren't super high.

Adaptibar is probably a great choice if you aren't actually doing a bar prep course. The nice thing about the UBE is that the essay topic areas only have 1 or 2 extra sections that don't also appear on the MBE. So reading the explanations in the answers is also helping you study for the essays.

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 10:05 am)

Thanks. Yeah, motivation will be key. And Adaptibar feels like it might be worth it. I want to go through teh Kaplan book as well, and doing MBE questions seems to be a good way to study.

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anonattempt (Apr 27, 2017 - 6:06 pm)

2 months? It's enough time only if you put in at least a 2-3 hours of studying every day.

I studied for a UBE bar for 2.5 months, at about 30 hours per week, and I passed with flying colors, so that was probably overkill (although I am generally good at tests)...

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mrtor (Apr 26, 2017 - 12:13 pm)

Why go through the stress, expense, and time commitment just to attempt such a menial achievement? Passing would amount to nothing more than a symbolic victory, and a frustrating one at that since you are unlikely to be admitted. Research C&F in your state. As you mentioned, those defaulted loans, which you do not plan to pay off, will likely be a permanent barrier. If so, passing the bar will only hurt more. You'd be at the finish line with absolutely no hope of ever crossing it. Why do that to yourself?

I do not believe two-and-a-half months of "nights and weekends" studying is enough, especially given your difficulty with the earlier bar exam. Most study full-time during that period of time. If you just want to go for it, then what the heck. Go for it.

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 10:04 am)

Thanks, Mrtor.

As far as "Why go through the stress, expense, and time commitment just to attempt such a menial achievement?" That's a fair question.

Essentially, I am sick onto death of coworkers who don't know I have a law degree asking me why don't I become a lawyer, and other co-workers, friends, and family asking whether I've taken/passed the bar, why don't I take it, etc. I'm tired of either having to evade the question or telling people I failed (it was years ago, I was unemployed, and yet I still feel like an idiot for failing an exam that is apparently passed by people who barely speak English (I mean, their rich parents usually paid thousands for "LLM tutoring" or whatnot, but still...). So it's a pride issue, and little else. That is somewhat petty, but we aging paralegals are petty people :-)

Also, and this may just be an attempt to rationalize, but if I my efforts to leave "the law" (which I was never actually in haha) get anywhere, they'll probably kick into high gear next fall... so if I don't take the exam now, I don't think I ever will. Thus see pride issue above.

But I see your points as pretty valid and will consider things.

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dingbat (Apr 26, 2017 - 12:40 pm)

you already failed the bar in the past, haven't been in law school for several years, don't want to take a prep course, and can't start until mid-may?

I guarantee you'll pass!*

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dingbat (Apr 26, 2017 - 12:41 pm)

*this guarantee is no more valid than Cooley's guarantee that everyone will get a job working for a biglaw firm paying $180k within 9 months of graduation
*alternatively, this guarantee's validity is equal to Whittier's bar passage rates... for new matriculants

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 9:58 am)

That's funny. It'd be kinda funny if I passed though, but I see your point.

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bucwild (Apr 26, 2017 - 12:54 pm)

I studied for the bar exam while working a full time non legal job right after law school. Leave a throw away email address if you want tips on balancing study/work.

And yes, I passed on first attempt.

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 9:57 am)

Thanks, man. Yeah, I'd appreciate that. Carlwolfmann@gmail.com.

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c3844122 (Apr 26, 2017 - 3:14 pm)

I think you should be able to pass, granted I did not work while studying. I failed the first go around and then passed the second go around. However, a friend of mine said she only studied for 3-4 hour intervals after work and took some weekends off and she passed the second time (this was a shock to me as I thought you needed to put in all your energy into studying). She stared studying in December for the February exam. I studied all day beginning in Nov, which in hindsight was a mistake b/c I spent the majority of the day panicking everytime I got a low MBE or essay score, also focusing so much made me feel like I was losing my mind. So I think having the distraction of work may be a benefit.

I don't think you need to purchase a course if you are disciplined and have all the materials, however, you did say your state was switching over to UBE so it actually might be worth it to buy a course.

As for adaptibar, I used it in conjunction with Themis, b/c some of the questions were simulated on Themis and adaptibar has all real questions. What I loved about adaptibar was that it was customizable (you could break quizzes down by subsection) and there was a discussion board where you could talk about questions with other test takers. I did almost 3,000 questions, but my MBE score only went up two points (but then again I think 20 were experimental). I did better on the essays which during the exam I was convinced I bombed, but by the grace of God I passed.

If you leave an email address I can share more tips and sample practice essays and whatever else you need.

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 9:56 am)

Thanks for the advice. My throwaway is carlwolfmann@gmail.com, any tips are appreciated...

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kretan182 (Apr 27, 2017 - 10:35 am)

I passed the MBE for FL using Adaptibar....I highly recommend it since it uses only real, previously released questions. You can practice by individual topic, and you get detailed explanations with all the answers.

I took the UBE for CT....I simply studied the outlines daily every day. I didn't even do any practice essays, I simply read the fact pattern and the subsequent suggested answer. There are a lot of topics to study, but a condensed outline should do the trick. Kaplan UBE study materials worked for me.

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 1:20 pm)

yeah thanks I'm focusing on the MBE for the time being

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mnjd (Apr 27, 2017 - 11:24 am)

I worked full time up until three weeks before the exam. Signed up for Barbri for the books, but did not follow their schedule. I also had a wife and three kids at the time. I passed MN. I then took WI, studied for a week and passed the following July. My method:

Essays - Read, read and reread the essays in Barbri's books over and over. Don't write out answers. Simply answer the question in your head, then look at the correct answer. Memorize an outline for the limited issues they ask. For example, Battery = intent, contact harm. IRAC that and you should be golden. Do this for each topic that comes up in the essays.

MBE - Practice Practice Practice. Critical Pass Flash Cards - Everyday - Whole Set, Adaptibar everyday 10-20 questions in each subject and Emanuael's Strategies & Tactics for the MBE. All this transfers to the essays as well.

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 1:19 pm)

thanks

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lawyer2 (Apr 27, 2017 - 11:53 am)

If I may ask, why not just get your debt in order. As long as you're paying SOMETHING towards it and showing the Committee effort why not actually shoot for being admitted?

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 1:19 pm)

I am not opposed to paying SOMETHING (after all, I am repaying what few federal loans I was able to get, and have done so even when I was living on unemployment benefits and odd jobs after that ran out) and obviously would like to get admitted at some point, if possible... but paying "something" certainly wasn't good enough for my private lender back in the day, who happily defaulted me when I couldn't pay close to a thousand a month while being unemployed after running out of hardship deferments and such... remember, these are private loans, so there is NO IBR, PAYE, PLSF or any of that junk, and there is no way I could afford to pay anything close to the full freight on my current salary - which is pretty much what I made before LS.

There can also be legal implications to trying to repay a debt after the SOL has run - essentially it opens you up to being sued for the entire amount and having your wages garnished... and I am not at all convinced that doing so would actually help me get admitted.

Like I said, it's not that I'm dead set against paying, but I'd like to avoid rashly doing things based on insufficient info, especially things that would leave me screwed all over again for nothing (which is a pretty good overall description for my law school experience:-).

Thanks for the advice though, it's obviously on my mind.

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lawyer2 (Apr 27, 2017 - 1:40 pm)

I understand. I would strongly suggest consulting an ethics attorney if you haven't already. I sincerely thought I'd never be admitted until working with ethics counsel because of my colorful past and was just admitted.

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 1:50 pm)

Actually, I have a question about that, for the future: how did you go about finding a legitimate "ethics" attorney? Was it someone who previously worked on a C&F committee in your state? Where do these guys advertise?

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lawyer2 (Apr 27, 2017 - 1:58 pm)

I got a recommendation from a classmate who had similar issues. Alternatively, call the state bar for a recommendation. Many have worked on the Committee before and are very familiar with the process.

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wolfman (Apr 27, 2017 - 2:19 pm)

thanks

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wolfman (May 5, 2017 - 4:21 pm)

UPDATE: thanks for the advice y'all. I signed up for the UBE and will take it in July. We'll just have to see what happens.

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jdtrash (May 11, 2017 - 12:26 pm)

UBE is a lot easier than California. I took the UBE while working full time in biglaw 8-6. I started studying in early/mid January. I did about 1-2 hrs a day.

I recommend smartbarprep for essay help.

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