Celebrating 10 years! 2007-2017

Leverage Job or Just Put in 2 Weeks Notice?

Hello all: I'd like some unbiased advise. I work in a BLF0802/10/17
The management doesn't respect you, I would advise moving on triplesix02/10/17
It's time to move on OP. If you have secured another gig isthisit02/10/17
I don't see the risk in leveraging the new job before puttin jd4hire02/10/17
the risk is that you end up staying, but now they think you' dingbat02/11/17
I'm not that interested in firm life. I don't need to get r BLF0802/10/17
This is what I suggest: You do not go to management and s whatisrap02/10/17
^This tcpaul02/17/17
So, with regard to whatisrap's post, I have already had this BLF0802/10/17
The key, in my experience, is to find the right balance of " whatisrap02/10/17
You sure they aren't trying to generate that attrition, incl kw6713a02/10/17
Hadn't thought of that. It would surprise me, given how und BLF0802/10/17
Doesn't really affect your decision if true but at least you kw6713a02/10/17
Well it is personal but there ain't a thing he can do beside triplesix02/10/17
The positions are vacant because government bureaucrats enjo mrtor02/16/17
Sadly, the offer I thought was coming is taking its time to blf0802/17/17
Having previously worked in government myself, remember that qport02/20/17
BLF08 (Feb 10, 2017 - 10:48 am)

Hello all:

I'd like some unbiased advise. I work in a state government litigation job. I've been here for five years and still work on the base-level. This is a bit frustrating, in that, I feel I'm a top performer. For example, I won an award under the previous administration this last year.

The agency I work in just turned over with the recent elections. I thought this would be good news because I already had a relationship built with the individual who won the election. I thought it was finally time for a promotion. I reached out to the new management to discuss my options, but was told by one person that the best way to get a promotion is to leverage a job offer. I was told by another person that he was "aware of my situation," but has otherwise ignored my request to discuss my options.

I have met with another agency and have been told an offer is likely coming (not guaranteed yet, but I'm confident it will). This other offer is better pay, but it is not litigation, which is what I've always seen myself doing. In sum, I'd rather be where I'm at, but the money isn't working.

So, my question. Do we all think that new management is "just not that into me;" therefore, I need to just put in my two weeks notice? Or would it be worth approaching them again for a promotion?

I'd love everyone's thoughts.

Thanks.

Reply
triplesix (Feb 10, 2017 - 10:50 am)

The management doesn't respect you, I would advise moving on based on the facts provided. I don't think there is anyway to recover from it unless management changes.

Reply
isthisit (Feb 10, 2017 - 11:27 am)

It's time to move on OP.

If you have secured another gig than put in your 2 weeks at the current one.

Reply
jd4hire (Feb 10, 2017 - 11:32 am)

I don't see the risk in leveraging the new job before putting in your pay. I haven't worked in government, but according to my colleagues that do, it can be a crazy world in regards to how employees are managed.

I'd try and get a private offer to leverage (assuming a private offer would have better pay than the public agency you are expecting an offer from).

Reply
dingbat (Feb 11, 2017 - 1:55 am)

the risk is that you end up staying, but now they think you're looking for an out, so they don't give any further promotions, don't give the good assignments, and if there's ever any cutbacks, guess who's first on the chopping block?

Reply
BLF08 (Feb 10, 2017 - 11:41 am)

I'm not that interested in firm life. I don't need to get rich and I didn't like the responsibility of billing/bringing in clients when I was in that world before. Government work, non-profit or, if I give up litigation, in-house counsel work are the places I could see myself.

I would leverage, but I don't want to come off as desperate (which I worry I already have by reaching out to more than one person in management). Even if I leave, I have to maintain a good reputation.

Reply
whatisrap (Feb 10, 2017 - 12:14 pm)

This is what I suggest:

You do not go to management and say you have a position that pays X and you are willing to stay but they have to do X, Y, Z. Once you have this other offer, you go in and have a franc discussion with management in which you tell them where you would like to see yourself within the agency, why your present situation is not working you and what you will need to be changed if you are going to continue to work there. There is no need to put a gun to their head and give them an ultimatum. You have leverage, and you use the fact that you won't be on the bread line if they don't give you what you want, but you do not give them the "I want this or I'm leaving". Use the position of power that you are in to see if your employer values you but do not bring up the fact that you have another job offer.

In my experience, there is little downside to this approach. Just be prepared to walk and take the other position if they don't give you what you are looking for. One last thing, always ask for 10-15% more than what you really want. Hardly ever will an employer agree to your first offer. You will need to do the dance.

Reply
tcpaul (Feb 17, 2017 - 8:18 am)

^This

Reply
BLF08 (Feb 10, 2017 - 12:24 pm)

So, with regard to whatisrap's post, I have already had this discussion. That discussion went nowhere. The only thing lacking in that discussion is being able to tell them I have an offer.

FWIW, we're working at 2/3 capacity by attrition (former administration was Democrat, new is Republican, so many people just left). There are numerous supervisor positions open, but they have not promoted anyone. I know there are openings, but they're just sitting on them, for whatever reason. On top of that, I have enough responsibility that I know it would sting if I left.

Reply
whatisrap (Feb 10, 2017 - 12:42 pm)

The key, in my experience, is to find the right balance of "if you don't do this i'm leaving vs. this is what I deserve and why". You want to imply that you have another offer without actually saying so. The conversation should have the tone of "while I would hate to do it, I will have no choice but to leave". If you were clear and straightforward in your approach, where they should have understood that you were saying you will leave if such and such doesn't happen, then I would just go for broke- Give them a number of 10-20% more than what you want, tell them you want the promotion, and if you aren't satisfied with their counteroffer, leave.

Best of luck

Reply
kw6713a (Feb 10, 2017 - 1:06 pm)

You sure they aren't trying to generate that attrition, including relative to you? The suggestion to find a job offer for example.

Reply
BLF08 (Feb 10, 2017 - 2:42 pm)

Hadn't thought of that. It would surprise me, given how understaffed they have become, but possible.

Reply
kw6713a (Feb 10, 2017 - 2:49 pm)

Doesn't really affect your decision if true but at least you don't have to take it personally that they aren't moving you up (not that you should anyway).

Reply
triplesix (Feb 10, 2017 - 3:09 pm)

Well it is personal but there ain't a thing he can do besides leave which he should do ASAP and let them enjoy the work pile up.

Reply
mrtor (Feb 16, 2017 - 2:46 pm)

The positions are vacant because government bureaucrats enjoy the status quo. So long as things are functioning, there is no motivation to change anything. Imagine a bureaucrat going to the Republican leadership and demanding they allocate large amounts of taxpayer money to fill positions which heretofore have been unnecessary to daily operations. Given the politics of the situation, said individual would probably not be well received. Few people are going to put themselves in that position unless they have to.

You need real bargaining power to overcome the status quo. It appears your tenure and work results were not strong enough bargaining power under the circumstances. Which, frankly, makes sense since most workers in your position will quietly go back to their grind. That bargaining power, therefore, is entirely illusory. In order to transform illusory bargaining power to real bargaining power, you must have an immediately feasible alternative -- another job offer. If you're valuable enough, the alternative job offer may be the leverage you need to get some bureaucrat to go to the leadership and obtain approval for your promotion.

However, that bureaucrat needs to know that you're serious about leaving -- and that he will have to pick up your slack -- before he'll stick his neck out.

Reply
blf08 (Feb 17, 2017 - 10:35 am)

Sadly, the offer I thought was coming is taking its time to come through (which makes me nervous). I hate having to operate while in a holding pattern :/ I agree with mrtor though, there is no leverage without an offer.

Reply
qport (Feb 20, 2017 - 2:50 pm)

Having previously worked in government myself, remember that unlike the private sector almost all government agencies operate on a yearly budget with little unaccounted for money left over. There's $X number of dollars in salaries, $Y for office expenses, etc. The raises I received in government were due to my boss going to the powers that be and explaining he would like to increase personnel costs by the amount of my raise for next year's budget. Then they would either say yes or no.

You can have all the leverage in the world within your agency, but if your agency supervisor doesn't have the money in the budget for additional salaries then the money just isn't there. Likewise, if your supervisor was given the order to reduce headcount by attrition then regardless of what he personally feels about you he may not be able to give you a raise.

Of course, there's a lot of benefits to government work beyond salaries. No pressure to bill, good benefits, lots of holidays off, less likely to be laid off for economic reasons, etc. If you do plan to jump ship make sure you're factoring all of that into account before you put in your 2 weeks.

Reply
Post a message in this thread